Who Gets the Nukes?

Anyone who doesn’t have an answer — a specific, implementable answer — to that question hasn’t thought this thing through.

There have been two cases of nuclear powers voluntarily surrendering their weapons. One is South Africa, which, though we should all be thanking whatever Great Spirit we believe in it happened — can you imagine? — doesn’t really teach us anything, as “South Africa” basically ceased to exist as a nation-state shortly thereafter, “nation-state” not being a concept the African mind can grasp at the present time.

The other was the Ukraine, and look what happened to those guys.

As much as we all know the neocons were just trying to spin up another war for all the usual reasons back in 2014, they did have a single, unassailable argument in their favor — we, the United States, were legally obligated to come to Ukraine’s aid in the event of an invasion, as a condition of them surrendering their nuclear weapons. Too bad it never got to the Supreme Court — we could’ve had John Roberts declaring war for us, instead of just awarding Tulsa to the Injuns, based on treaties no one in their right mind thought the US government had any intention of honoring anyway.

The United States has a gigantic nuclear arsenal. If you don’t believe we also have shitloads of chemical and biological weapons, too, no matter what the treaties say — see above, re: Indian Country — then I’ve got a few bridges to sell you. Any “peaceful” dissolution of the United States has to deal with those realities.

“Peaceful” needing the quotation marks, of course, because the ur-premise of all the keyboard commandos is that the POCs hate us and want us dead. So… how many nukes will we be giving them when we withdraw to Whiteystan? Oh, none? And their incentive to agree to peaceful separation is….?

The best the White folks of the United States can realistically get is some kind of divided-sovereignty, Austro-Hungarian Empire-type arrangement. Anything else ends in a nuclear exchange.* Within that context, I’m happy to do anything I can to help my fellow Whites, because that’s my tribe. I’m also willing to help spread that civilization to whomever is willing to embrace it, because that’s how civilization works — the French and British had to be civilized by the Romans before they could start spreading civilization to others. History is what it is.


*and that does too, most likely, but let’s leave our friends in the People’s Liberation Army out of it for simplicity’s sake.

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26 thoughts on “Who Gets the Nukes?

  1. MBlanc46

    Good points, all. I’m not terribly concerned about the nukes. We’re not even sure that they still work. And I wouldn’t put too much stock in the ability of the Left to employ them, even if they should be inclined to do so, despite their adoration of science. You have read their stuff, so you know that maths and engineering are not their strong suits. Peaceful separation is a long shot, no doubt about it. Any kind of separation is a long shot. Because they are not going to put up with any kind of divided sovereignty. They do not accept that we have a right to exist, and they will not accept it unless they absolutely have to, which will only happen if we can demonstrate that they do not have the strength to crush us. I’ll cop to talking a fair bit about peaceful separation. But when I’m being careful, and I usually try to be careful, I say that it is the only way that serious conflict can be avoided. I throw in “peaceful” as bait, to try to get people to take the idea of separation seriously. Truth to tell, at least in my more sober moments, I don’t think that serious conflict can be avoided*. The far likeliest outcomes are that they will crush us, or we’ll be able to put up enough of a fight that they can’t stop us from separating. If the latter point comes, we can worry about who has the nukes, whether the nukes work, or whether the butch lesbians and men in sundresses who have them know how to use them.

    * Unless whites simply roll over and let themselves be exterminated, which is always a possibility.

    1. Severian Post author

      Well, there it is. I’m just following that idea that serious bloodletting is inevitable out to its conclusion.

      I don’t mean “the National Guard patrolling the streets of Atlanta”-level bloodletting. I mean actual regular army units being shot at, and shooting back. The US Army absolutely does not believe in “proportional response.” Absent the kind of retardedly restrictive Rules of Engagement they currently operate under in faraway places, the standard response to some jihadi popping a shot off at a convoy would be airstrikes, artillery, anything and everything in range. If it comes to violent conflict within the US, do you think they’re going to restrain themselves?

      [“You” meaning “the standard-issue keyboard commandos who talk up the Great Boogaloo,” of course. You, MBlanc46, are a sensible, reasonable individual].

      Putting it in terms of a nuclear exchange is simply the best way I can think of to clarify the actual stakes involved. “[Being] able to put up enough of a fight that they can’t stop us from separating” covers a LOT of territory, but it’s still ultimately ducking the question. At what point do the POCs — and the Goodwhites who, as we all know, will provide the officer corps of the POC army — decide they’ve had enough? Before or after the airstrikes level Cleveland? Before or after the satchel nukes in San Francisco?

      I would take almost any solution short of actual genocide over that….

      …and of course, here’s where the keyboard commando jumps in and says “yeah, that’s what I’m talking about, actual genocide!!” All I can say is, if you really believe that — if you’re really gearing up to duke it out in your bunker, right now, today — then shine on you crazy diamond, that’s between you and the ten thousand Feds who are getting ready to Waco your ass the moment you declare your jihad.

      Me, personally, I think there are lots of at least semi-peaceable ideas we ought to give a shot first… what with, you know, the looming possibility of nuclear exchange and all.

      If that makes me a “CivNat” or a “cuck” or, sigh, one of (((them))) — and who’s to say I’m not, bwahahaha! — then so be it. I’m not an Internet Tough Guy, that’s for sure.

      1. MBlanc46

        I’m certainly ready to listen to any semi-peaceable ideas. I’m a peaceful guy who just wants to be left alone to read, potter about in the garden, and indulge myself in projects that never seem to get finished. But it doesn’t seem to me that our enemies are prepared to listen to any semi-peaceable ideas. They truly believe that we are consummate evil, and, that when we are seen off, earthly paradise will ensue. They smell victory, their tails are up, and they are determined to crush us. (If I were a betting man, I’d bet that they will succeed.) It certainly doesn’t seem that we have the strength to crush them. Therefore, it appears that the only chance whites in America have to avoid being crushed is to find a defensible place and try to stand them off. I’m not sure that it has to come to fighting off the 101st Airborne.* Their resources won’t be infinite and they’re led by loons. And who knows what condition the 101st Airborne will be in after fifteen or twenty years of President Harris, President Abrams, and President Trigglypuff. I certainly don’t intend this to come off as being an Internet Tough Guy. But those certainly seem to me to be the only possible futures: be crushed, crush, or break away. I’m happy to listen to other analyses.

        * I’ve just been reading the official US Army history of the 1944 Ardennes offensive and the siege of Bastogne. Some of those airborne troops were tough MFers. I don’t know what their record is lately, but on the whole the US military doesn’t have a lot of recent trophies.

        1. Severian Post author

          I hear you. But the one thing that gets lost so frequently in all of this is that “social justice,” negrophilia, and the rest are diseases of luxury. Everything we see right now is terminal decadence. A major economic …. correction, let us say, plus a very likely major military defeat, and who knows where the rickety barge formerly known as the USA will end up?

          I recommend Peter Heather’s great book The Fall of the Roman Empire (you know it’s good because the Amazon reviews keep saying it has been “discredited by recent scholarship.” “Recent scholarship” being, as always, the “work” of gays, girls and trannies). He shows how the Roman Empire was quite strong, working great… until it wasn’t. They lurched from crisis to crisis in the space of about 50 years. Any one of them would’ve been endurable on its own, but cumulatively they caused the shockingly quick collapse.

          As Z Man pointed out* the other day, you’d have expected the lockdowns to cause massive economic dislocation. They haven’t, somehow… which means our understanding of some fundamental things about economics is badly wrong. Maybe this IS the new normal — useless people getting quasi-sexual thrills out of persecuting the last few truly essential workers — but that’s not the way I’d bet. Right now we can still afford to pay some mulatto almost half a billion dollars to throw a football… and the multi-billion-dollar industry parasitic on it to talk about it 24/7. Will we still have that luxury in 10 years? Extremely doubtful.

          *He’s still good, but Holy Cheebus that comment section is all but unreadable now. “You don’t agree that Teh Jooooooos!! are sapping our precious bodily fluids? FED!!!” “No way, I’m not a Fed, you’re a Fed!!” etc.

          1. MBlanc46

            Ah, yes, the larger context. That certainly does throw a spanner into everyone’s predictive works. The whole minoritarian project (if that’s what AnotherDad over at Sailer’s calls it) is about First World Problems. And First World Problems disappear in a puff of smoke when the First World economy disappears. Which might or might not occur anytime now. (My guess is sooner rather than later, but no one will know when it’s going to happen until it’s happening.) And our enemies live in fantasyland. They are not exactly the sorts to keep the First World economy going. That said, those who bankroll them are perhaps just the types to keep the First World economy going, even with President Abrams at the helm (along with her counterparts in the UK, Germany, etc.). And then there are the Chinese, who apparently have designs on replacing the US as hegemon. Who knows what their plans are? I would be rather more concerned about facing the Peoples’ Army than I would be about facing the 101st Airborne with some black tranny in command instead of Tony McAuliffe. However it turns out, it looks like there are a lot more possible bad outcomes for white folks than possible good outcomes.

          2. Frip


            Affirmative. It’s an issue. Many problems. Repetive commentary.
            Paranoia. Rigidity. Binary thinking. Perhaps age related. Smart guys. But I may need to find another crue to hang with. Plenty of other blog comment sections to choose from, I’d assume. Will always feel certain bond with those guys But it’s bringing me down. Will prolly start looking. (I’m being over dramatic prolly. But yeah, quickly getting to be not my kinda scene. Or maybe it never was).

          3. BadThinker

            Agreed on )))commenters(((. It’s one thing to recognize a group with interests. It’s another to bang on about them nonstop.

            I’d say the biggest thing is right now we have a massive amount of dopamine being released into most of the population’s brains thanks to the magic phone and it’s direct link to the Like Button.

            I think we only see many folks waking up when that hit goes away. It might never go away, and we simply slide down into living among rubble, playing candy crush.

  2. Fifteenth Reader

    I just read a Quillette article (yea, I know) about the Vendee insurrection and subsequent massacre/genocide. It was the classic peasant revolt of pitchforks against a trained professional army. Guess who won. And when those believers in Liberte, Egalite, and Fraternite won, the massacred everyone they could get their hands on, old, young, women, babies. Sobering. I don’t think today’s True Believers are going to be any more merciful.

    1. Severian Post author

      If it truly comes to that, then yeah, I’ll go down fighting. I’m not getting in the boxcar. I’m too old to be much use in the infantry, but I’m sure they can find a use for me in the support troops… or, failing all else, in self-detonation in a crowded enemy area.

      BUT: That’s seriously what it’s going to take. This whole “All we have to do is walk away / form our own ethno-state / deport ’em all / etc.” is sheer fantasy, no more in contact with reality than our enemies, who can’t figure out what gender they are today. There’s no negotiating with maniacal religious zealots, which we all agree they are….

      The saving grace of the whole situation is, their maniacal religious zealotry is the definition of “First World Problems.” Give these fools something real to worry about, and watch how quickly they figure out exactly what gender they are, and which side of their bread’s buttered.

      That will be unpleasant for everyone, and painful in the extreme for all the parasites who make their living off this stuff. But it won’t be the end of the world; it’ll just be Yugoslavia.

      The apocalyptic scenario, the real end-of-the-world stuff, only kicks in if present trends continue… which we all agree they can’t. Even the Keyboard Commandos of the 101st Mom’s Basement Division agree that debt levels alone are crippling, and that some kind of large economic… restructuring, let us say, is inevitable.

      There are lots of possible real-world responses to that. “Forming up Whitey-stan in the Idaho Mountains” ain’t one of them, which is what I’m trying to point out with the “consider the nukes” situation.

  3. Fifteenth Reader

    Most people instinctively realize this, which is why most people are go along to get along, even in the face of terrible persecution. However, I have no patience left for the “everything will be just fine, it’ll all blow over” crowd. We all need to think about the various scenarios, and at least mentally prepare ourselves and our families.

    This is everything from increased unrest and riots, to ethnic and racial fighting (with certain people actually fighting back this time), to increased persecution and disappearing of badthinkers, to outright civil war if someone with an army division decides to go rogue. We have know idea what the future holds, but thinking “everything is fine” will not serve anyone when the S hits the F.

    1. Severian Post author

      True enough. Realism in all things. It’s possible to be neither a Pollyanna nor a Keyboard Commando. That’s why I don’t read many blogs (and almost no comment sections) anymore — too much all-or-nothing, sturm und drang.

  4. Fifteenth Reader

    Another thing people need to get out of their thick skulls: the “lone hero takes a stand then everyone falls in behind him and overthrows the bad guys.” This happens only in bad movies. Most people are followers, but they follow people with actual power, not isolated individuals who take a stand. They rightly understand those types to be lone wackos who they need to stay very far away from.

    Lone individuals can’t do anything, people in small groups can’t do much more. Only when people with power take our side will we have even a small fighting chance. But the”Lone Hero” is a common trope among right wingers.

    And the guns, the guns, guns, guns. Who, exactly, do they think they are going to point those guns at? They all think it will be mobs of feral rioters. Firstly, we are no longer allowed to defend ourselves from mobs. See the Missouri couple who attempted to defend their mansion from Burn, Loot, Murder. Secondly, who do they think is going to pry their guns from their cold, dead fingers? I guarantee it will be someone in a uniform. The very people the 2A larpers have been hero worshipping and blindly following for the past several decades.

    TL;DR, the time for LARPing is over. The time for thinking about how we realistically respond to our situation is now. It may come to violence, but we must be realistic about it. It won’t be a fantasy.

  5. Wildgoose

    I’ve just read a great article about how when Great Powers break up, what is happening is invisible to those on the inside: https://www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/russia-fsu/2020-06-30/how-great-power-falls-apart

    As an (English) observer of the United States, my guess (because my knowledge is limited) is that there will be a move to States robustly affirming their States Rights and banding together with like-minded neighbours into regional blocs. Situations evolve from a starting point. They don’t just transition overnight. The process takes time. We can imagine the likely outcome, but what are the steps along the way?

    A very real catalyst could be this November’s elections and is likely to be more extreme if Trump wins a second term. But whoever wins it could happen, because either losing side will probably consider the election has been stolen from them. Think of an even more hysterical version of 2016. And that’s the problem. Democracy requires that the participants accept the results of a vote. Since 2016, the Democrats haven’t. It just needs the Republicans to join in.

    The Election Result will just determine which set of States begins the process – perhaps later some States may themselves begin to split, either to create a new state, (e.g. Northern California from Southern California), or for a sizable contiguous chunk of counties to join an adjacent state more to their liking.

    Of course, the only thing we really know is that it will be a long drawn-out process rather than a sudden collapse. Slowly, slowly – then all at once.

    That’s my guess, anyway, and I freely admit that this is coloured by our increasingly fragmented “United” Kingdom over on my side of the pond.

    1. Publius

      I think this is a strong point.

      State governments have some rather immediate powers, and if the FedGov experiences a sudden legitimacy shortage, for whatever reason, there’s nothing stopping new confederations from being formed.

      And if that happens under a larger Austro-Hungary agreement, under which representatives still meet in the Swamp on the Potomac and make a Great Show of Doing Nothing, some vaguely-EU type of deal, so be it.

      Regardless, we must shove for what we want: a future for our posterity.

    2. MBlanc46

      If President Trumps fails re-election, the Dems will certainly accept the results of the election. The people have spoken! We can now continue fundamentally transforming the nation! I imagine that Repub pols and donors will also accept the results of the election. That’s what Repubs do. Fight the good fight and fail to understand why they lost. But I suspect that a lot of Trump voters will not accept the results of the election. What effect that will have on state and local governments, I do not claim to know. But it will be the end of the end of the American republic. Sorting out what comes next will not be pleasant.

  6. WOPR

    If or when things do collapse, nukes might be a problem. It takes a solid technical base and money to maintain them. One possibility is TPTB will be more than happy to disband the arsenal for payouts from the ChiComs. They can then use that money for crushing resistance and paying off allies. Sure they are under the thumb of the Chinese. How is that much different than today?

    I have serious doubts on the capabilities of our remaining arsenal. The land based ICBM’s had a bolt that required a special wrench to gain access for maintenance. The Air Force, somehow, was down to one wrench that they mailed to the different bases.

    Anyways, for us to have a fighting chance, it means creating the reality on the ground. First that means, as Fifteenth Reader pointed out, we have to look at ourselves as a group. None of this individualism uber alles. We have to create pockets where we slowly assume control and move on from there. I’m sure far smarter people than I have put thought into it. But, you don’t start a revolution without already having control.

    * Regarding the Zman comment section, yes it has deteriorated. I’m willing to debate the Civil War anytime. However, other than looking at it for historical similarities, whether Lincoln was friend or fiend is irrelevant to our problems today. Obsessing about it doesn’t provide anything now. Next, worrying about the people with the funny hats isn’t going to help either. If they are in charge, then just attacking the establishment is enough. Making it about them specifically attracts no one. Thank the Cat Fanciers for that.

    1. MBlanc46

      In addition to the technical issues—which are real and perhaps sufficient in themselves to render nukes hors de combat—there is the political issue. The Left have been anti-nukes ever since there have been nukes. It will be difficult for them to maintain the arsenal once they have permanent power after having been furiously anti-nukes for seventy-five years.

  7. Maus

    One of the only times I was sent to the principal’s office for a disciplinary reason in middle school was because I had advocated with complete sincerity for dropping the H bomb on the Panama Canal rather than surrendering American sovereignty over it. This provoked a fellow student to suggest aloud that my initials ought to be A.H. He meant Uncle Adolf, but the teacher interpreted it as short for asshole. In either case, I was apparently at fault. So, true to form, I’ll go there. It won’t take many of those nukes, and the neutron bomb is preferable because it leaves the buildings standing. Instead of separating, let’s just nuke the coastal cities of the blue states, as well as Minneapolis, Chicago, Detroit, St. Louis, Milwaukee, New Orleans (I think you get the idea for demographically-defined targeting) etc.. Demo first on two of the more chocolate cities without warning; then give people fourteen days to depart from all remaining targets. The economic and organizational resources necessary to do this should filter folks efficiently enough. Then let ’em fly. Machiavelli would approve; and it fits the “hate, so long as you fear” prescription recently quoted by Sev. Who will be our American Pol Pot?

  8. Maus

    On a more serious note, I am inclined to agree with the observation about Zman’s comment section. As the postings have grown to well over 300 a day, the signal to noise ratio has become atrocious. I’ve reduced my commenting to one or two maybe twice a week; but I’ve had to accept that my Boomer attitudes, five-dollar words and dry sarcasm are lost on most of the new in-crowd there. I don’t know whether I am part of the problem; but it is certain that I’m won’t be part of the solution. Now that the up/down voting function is disabled, there’s not even a quick proxy for ignoring a comment. All together, I find reading his blog is becoming more of a chore than a pleasure. That latter honor now resides squarely with Sev. His comments are multiplying too; but the wit and insight from the (Insert current Number here) Readers continue to sparkle with bright clarity. And I’m not being dunned for donations or solicited to buy Alaskan fungus in the shade of the chestnut tree. Long may this stout fellow thrive!

  9. contrariandutchman

    The last time the righteous goodwhites launched a holy war it became known as the “Wars of Religion” and the German part, the final chapter being the thirty years war, was especially fun. Took awhile for everybody to have seen enough war where they accepted separation.

    1. Severian Post author

      I wrote here somewhere that I’m not saying these “autonomous zones” are Munster 1534… but I’m not not saying it, either.

  10. texinole

    Good points brought up and I’ve no plan, much less shovel-ready ideas for nukes, but perhaps I can ferret out a whitepill among the fallout.

    China, for all it’s faults, is a demographic timebomb slowly exploding in ChiCom central planners’ faces. Couple that with their trade dependencies and the inevitable monetary collapse means serious trouble for them, which means trouble for everyone.

    Given how utterly lacking in critical thinking and easily led the vast normie army seems to be, isn’t there at least a possibility that the left’s civil war – given the mound of luxuries it requires – weakens their hegemony enough that when the collapse occurs the threat posed by foreign aggression will have the norms clamoring for competent strong men? It’s a scenario the left would normally wet themselves with excitement over, but considering their religious dogma is anti-American and silly at its core, and their high priests are effete and quisling they might not be in a position to claim that mantle when the opportunity arises.

    TL;DR global war is likely inevitable but maybe we’ll actually have a team to root for when it comes. It’s not much of a silver lining, but the “solution” offered up by the movie Watchmen might be best-case scenario in the long-run.

    1. contrariandutchman

      War between major powers seems unlikely as all the major powers have serious internal stability issues, major demographic problems and mostly both. China faces demographic collapse end may well fragment into another warring states period, that will rather distract from any designs against the outside world.

      Of course, if the Wars of Religion analogy holds we are likely only at the start of something that will last the rest of the century and possibly beyond, so major power wars may become part of the later chapters once some major powers got their act together.

      1. texinole

        Internal struggles haven’t historically been a hindrance to war between nations, but rather often a pre-condition, no? What’s China, eg, to do with all those “excess” males resulting from their one-child policy, for instance? And the US briefly rallied behind a retarded chimp of a president after the 9/11 attacks, what about something that REALLY hurts?

        Wait, am I being whitepill or blackpill right now? I’ve honestly lost track.

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